Episode 287 is different on so many levels. I saw a tweet about this film called “Sign The Show.”

I need you to see all of the resources available on this episode BECAUSE of this episode. Cat Brewer is an educator who is passionate about the deaf community. Her story is incredible. How she made the film is incredible. She is incredible. We so often take for granted what we have easy access too. DO NOT MISS THIS EPISODE. Full transcription and resources are below.

Download the Tubi App (it’s free)

Search “Sign The Show

Visit SignTheShow.com

Be changed and do better.




Welcome back to unscripted for my studios, my jerseys of hope studios here in Columbus, Ohio. Oh my goodness. I can’t be more excited. I don’t know if I’ve ever been more excited for an interview than I am today.  And Cat, I can’t wait to just. Talk to you and, and tell you our story. Oh, okay. So Cat, can you introduce yourself when we go from there?

Yes. My name is Cat Brewer and I’m an educator, a filmmaker, and an advocate for the deaf and hard of hearing community.  

Okay. So.  It’s incredible. I, we have so much to talk about. All right. So let me start at the very beginning. A few weeks ago, Eric Alper, do you know Eric Alper? 

I think  

I follow him on Twitter and I think he tweeted something about this film called, 


Called sign the show. And I, so I saw it and my wife. Also is an educator and her degree is in, you know, the deaf community. She has spent her career in the deaf community. She works in the deaf community, which is what I emailed you when I invited you to come on. And so just to give some background, I saw this tweet.

About this film  and I, I’m pretty sure it was from Eric and I don’t know, Eric, you might know him. I don’t, but I love his tweets. And so anyway, I saw it. And so we had a date night where we, we ordered some food in the house and we sat down and it was a surprise for her. Cause I’m like, you got to see this.

And  can I just tell you cat? Like I had to stop the film.  multiple times and ask her questions. So we have a lot to talk about. We have so much to talk about, but anyway, can you just talk about the film? Let’s just, let’s start with that. Can you start with the film or what your passion? Oh gosh, I have so many questions for you. 

So, you know, it’s interesting. I will let me, I want to kind of tell a little bit of a story, especially about Eric Alper. Yes. Right. So I’m an independent filmmaker. I do not have a background in film whatsoever. I have been a teacher. For the last 24 years and 10 years ago, I got a wild idea. It wasn’t even my idea, honestly, I was so  not the story is going to like weave around.

Right  here. I’ll, I’ll start from the beginning 10 years ago, I was going through a really challenging time in my life. And I was going out to concerts all the time. It was like what brought me joy. I was going to music concerts, live stand up comedy shows. I just needed laughter and joy in my life.

And I’ve been going to concerts since I was 8 years old. Maybe even before that. I think my first concert was Sha Na Na. I was going to ask you what your first concert was. I’m really bragging myself there.  And it was Rick Springfield, so. 

Mine was New Edition, so. 

Oh, man. Oh, that would have been a great one. 

So, in 2014,  for the very first time, I saw a sign language interpreter.  And I was ignorant. I didn’t realize that deaf people liked music, let alone liked going to live performances. And so I started talking with the interpreter that was there and then communicating with the deaf people through the interpreter because I didn’t know any sign language and come to find out deaf people, just like hearing people, love music, love to go to concerts and festivals, but they face a A very different set of challenges and barriers to getting access to live entertainment.

Think something that I had taken for granted my entire life was just like my ability to like, Oh, I want to go to that concert. I’m going to buy my ticket and go. And not having to worry if there was going to be access there. And so I decided to write an article for the college newspapers where I taught.

I taught at three community colleges in the Bay area. And my roommate at the time, like came home, it was like late. I’m sitting at the kitchen table typing and he’s like, what are you writing? And I was like, I was told him and he’s like, this would be a great documentary.  Oscar Serna. Thank you so much.  And so I said, okay.

I’ll do it. And I had no idea what I was doing.  I didn’t even own a camera. I went to Best Buy and talked to the guy for like two hours. I’m sure he was so annoyed with me. And then I just started what I call like hustling with gratitude and love. Like I’m knocking on doors, sending tweets,  sliding into DMS for the purpose of getting an interview,  like standing outside of of a Concert venue to try to find the artist, you know, at the back door.

So it was just a lot of, a lot of hustle, a lot of legwork and, and I loved that. It was fun. And so, which kind of leads me to the Eric Alper thing. So as an independent artist.  I still have to like hustle to get interviews to try to promote the film.  And so I think I tweeted him or actually I think I reached out to him on Instagram because I follow him there.

And I was like, Hey, like, since you’re a music lover, you might like this film. If you do, I would love for you to like, share it with your friends. And so he replied and he was like, Oh, like, this is great. I’d love to interview you for my show. I had no idea.  He was he had a show on Sirius XM had no clue and he’s also hard of hearing, which I thought was, yeah, it was very serendipitous, I think.

So that’s, that’s how Eric got involved. And I think tweeted out about the film. I’m super grateful that. It led me to you and your podcast. 

Oh my goodness. I’m  blown away. Seriously. I’m a huge fan of his. I love his tweets. Is he hard of hearing because of,  

was he born that 


I think he was born that way or perhaps lost some of his hearing at a youngish age.


Okay. Yeah. And it doesn’t matter. So there’s so many very gosh. Okay. All right. I’m all over the place. I. All right. So my wife and I sat down and this is an incredible film. So let’s, let’s tell that at the beginning in case people, you know, are just out walking their dog and, and then are back in the house and they missed the rest of the interview.

Please, where can they find the film? What is the film called? What are all the links? 

Sure. So it’s called sign the show. And if you go to sign the show. com, all the links for streaming are there. It’s on Tubi, which is free, completely free. And then it’s on Apple TV. Google Google play. I was gonna say Google docs.

I’m, I’m at work in my head.  To be Apple TV, Google play and YouTube and have no idea if it’ll be anywhere else, but it’s found a home there and I’m excited for people to see it. Yeah. If you just go to sign the show. com. All the links are there. 

So we watched it on Tubi. We downloaded this free Tubi app, but, but here’s the question I have to ask you.

Do you get, do you get compensation? Cause you did a lot of work. So I, and this may be welcome to unscripted. I don’t know. You know, if somebody buys it on Apple or Google, look at the end of the day, you did a lot of work. And so  do you understand the question? Like, I want to make sure you’re getting compensated for your work.

And I, I, I’m unfortunately like the Napster of movie people because I watched it off to be for free. No,  

not at all. Not at all. Good. So if 

people watch it off to be, you still get compensated. 

I think so. 


So yeah. Distribution again. I know, I knew nothing about filmmaking. I have learned. Everything as I’ve gone, what do they say?

Baptism by fire, like drinking from the water, like, I mean, fire hose. It’s just, so I had to learn and you know, I love my distributor, global digital releasing, picked up the film for me, got it on those platforms. I get a percentage,  I get a percentage,  everybody  gets paid. 

Well, and at the end of the day, I, I do think, and we’re going to get into this conversation because I do think that you probably did it for more than just to get paid because you have a passion and a heart for it and that, and that’s really, so, all right, let’s transition to that because the film itself is, I, I, I, you’ll probably do a better job explaining this than I can.

I think I’m a huge concert. I don’t go to a lot of concerts, but when I do, they’re important to me. My wife works in the deaf culture  and I had to ask her last night, here’s one example. Let me just give you one example. I asked her last night, what’s the appropriate thing to say? Because I’ve always heard hearing impaired.

Well apparently that’s not, and so I had to ask her last night because I want to be I want to be kind. I don’t want to offend someone. So let’s in the deaf culture. 

Yeah. I absolutely love that. It has, the film has inspired you to ask questions. Yes. So many questions to be more.  I mean, just the fact that you cared enough to say what’s the right term,  you know, like that means so much.

And that means not, not just to me, but to the deaf community. 

So the premise of the film for anybody listening the premise of the film is the fact that we get to go, I get to go watch Eric Church. and rock out to Eric Church. And I love that concert. I usually don’t take a quick peek to see if there’s an interpreter for Eric church.

That’s premise one. And I have a lot of questions about this premise two would be if there was an interpreter.  It might just be for that one night. So if Eric church is in Columbus, Ohio for three nights, let’s say let’s call Garth Brooks. Let’s just go big, right? Garth Brooks is in town. He’s in Columbus, Ohio for three nights. 

I get to go one of those nights. I don’t care which one of those nights, it’s just the one I can get, right? And I don’t have to think about something else like, will there be an interpreter there?  So the premise of the film, if I understand it correctly, and please correct me if I’m wrong, the premise of the film is the fact that the deaf community might only get an interpreter one night. 

And, and that may mean they miss. So if it’s Friday, Saturday, Sunday,  and the interpreter is going to be there on Saturday, but they have a conflict and can’t get there, then they don’t get to see Garth Brooks or Taylor Swift, or you name your faith. Think of your favorite artists in the night that they’re in town.

They would miss that concert  because there wasn’t an interpreter there. Is that okay? No.  

Yeah, I think that’s, that’s definitely fair to say. And I also think that the landscape is changing a little bit. I mean, I started, yeah, I started this film 10 years ago. So there’s, there have been some changes, some progress being made. 

What typically happens is. You know, as like you said, as hearing people going to a concert, we just go buy our ticket for whatever day that we want to go. And we go right for a deaf person. Typically what happens through either live nation or ticket master, they have to purchase their ticket first for the concert.

So maybe they do say like, Hey, I’m going to go on Saturday. And so they buy their ticket for Saturday. Then they have to take an extra step to request access.  And sometimes. Most of the time from the experience of interviewing probably over a hundred deaf individuals,  they, their requests go unheard or brushed to the side or not responded to or on an occasion, there’s a young man in the film named Aaron Matthews, and he talks about his experience Being excited to go to a Beyonce concert because for the deaf community, it’s also, they’re, they’re very drawn to visual aspects of concerts.

And so he bought his ticket to Beyonce. He communicated, he requested the interpreter, the ticket master emailed him back and was like, yep, we’ve got it. It’s all taken care of. And he’s like, excellent. This is great. Gets to the venue, no interpreter, no one has any idea what he’s talking about. So for him, that experience was was heartbreaking.

And it, I don’t want to say it was worthless, but it was much harder for him to enjoy the show. Same thing has happened with Live Nation. And I’ve had a chance, I’ve had a conversation to be able to address that with someone from Live Nation.  You know, interpreters were supposed to be hired. They with like six weeks before the concert, because also an interpreter has to study the music, the songs.

It’s ideal if they get a set list ahead of time, if they’re like, Hey, we’re hiring you for this.  Taylor Swift concert. Great. Right. You know, they have a really huge canon of work. There’s tons of songs. Like what are they going to sing? Right. Especially Garth. Cause I don’t think he’s put out a new album.

Right. But he does like, like songs from every album. So ideally an interpreter would be given a set list to say, here’s all the songs that the artist is going to sing.  And now you get to go study translate into a different language and practice that when you are interpreting the music on stage  that rarely happens interpreters typically just have to go, okay, what are their biggest hits?

What are we going to do? Let me study those, right? But sometimes interpreters are hired three days before a concert. And they have no idea what songs they’re going to interpret. And that’s a really tough call for them. And then another interpreter in the film, Amber Graves, talks about that. She’s like, what do I do?

Do I take it so that the deaf community has some access? Do I not take it and they have no access? So it’s a, it’s a really multilayered situation and there are ways to make it easier and better. And I think that there are some, some pro some progress happening with live nation. I’m, my fingers are crossed that they actually pull through. 

You just said the word layers and I might get emotional. Welcome to unscripted because that’s just, I might get emotional because at the end of the day, and I, I, I love so much the film.  I think the word is access.  


I, I, that’s the word I come back to you. You guys talk about ADA and  some things, and I want to share a story here at some point in this interview about just a, an eyeopening experience for me.

It didn’t have to do with the deaf culture, but an eyeopening experience for me and I’ll share that eventually, but  I think it’s about access and the fact that we take for granted.  We that get to hear, I, we have a deaf dog and I’ll talk about her too, but we have a deaf dog. And, and so for, for us to have adopt this dog, that’s two years old. 

And can’t hear it breaks my heart.  It breaks my heart. When she goes out to the backyard and the other dogs in the neighborhood are barking at her and she’s just walking around oblivious. Like she, you know what I’m saying? It’s such an eye opening experience. And that’s what I love about this film. So again, the film signed the show. 

Sign the show. com I, because everything we’re talking about today, you really need to watch the documentary. You did such a good job. And I really want to praise you for that because especially if you’re saying I’ve never done this before, my gosh, it was so good. There was a list. People in there, Kelly Clarkson, there’s so many are amazing artists that talk about this because it was eyeopening for all of us, including myself.

And so that’s one of the questions that I asked my wife was, okay, so I’m, let’s just say I’m, I I’m deaf.  I want to go see, we’ll keep using Taylor Swift cause she was the biggest concert of the summer. Right? So I want to go see Taylor Swift. I buy my ticket, as you just said,  but now I have to take another action. 

To reach out to ticket Matt because that’s so again pause the film I looked at my wife and I said  What do they do next and she said they have to contact the ticket agency. Is that correct? 


So they got to contact ticket master or cause I said, well, okay, so does, do they have call nationwide arena and say, Hey, we need someone like, how does that work?

And do they have to pay for them? Who did like, that’s what people need to realize is, do you understand just to go to a concert right now? I buy my ticket and yeah, there’s service fees and that’s a pain in the butt or I waited in line or I got a wrist brand, you know, right? Like that’s the worst thing that I have to do to go to a concert. 

What your film really pulls out is the fact that there’s multiple layers just for someone to go enjoy Taylor Swift, for example, and I’m not this has nothing to do with Taylor Swift. It has something to do with the entire industry. I’m just using an artist, right?  

Yes. The entertainment industry as a whole, I have learned it’s,  it’s pretty exclusionary.

You know, I looked at it just from the aspect of going to a concert first, right? Either a comedy show or a concert, but it just seems  honestly like everything I  don’t like to, I don’t like to put negativity out in the world,  but you know, when you see things, sometimes it’s hard for me. Me to stay quiet because I want, I want equal access for everyone.

So I’m, I’m kind of not the typical, I am not a typical filmmaker. So my approach to film festivals was not typical.  So we would, my film would get accepted into a film festival. Great. There’s going to, they would send you information. There’s going to be a Q and a great it’s me and my executive producer, Matt Maxey, who’s deaf.

We need an interpreter. Oh, sorry, we can’t provide an interpreter.  What do you mean you can’t provide an interpreter? Oh, it’s not in our budget. We don’t have interpreters.  And I mean, it really took all of my strength not to, like,  drop an F bomb and just be like,  like, what the, right you all programmed a film about accessibility, but yet you don’t want to provide accessibility.

It made no sense.  We had that battle with almost every single film festival that the film was in. So part of that, then I get used to it. Okay. It’s about educating. Now it’s about educating the film festivals, right? Like what do you need at a film festival? Well, you should have an interpreter for your Q and A’s.

Your film should have open captions. That’s a whole other issue. My film is open caption. So we put a disclaimer at the very beginning of the film that says for hearing people. Or deaf people, you do not need to turn on your closed captions because I want this to be experienced equally by both communities.

And typically movies are not open captioned. And in the deaf community, they jokingly or lovingly refer to them as crap tions. Because if you have closed captions on your TV and you read, like they’re never accurate. Right. Never accurate. Right. Sure. So it was a whole educating the film festival scene. I have, it, it made a little bit of an impact some places, but not maybe not enough.

And then also now reaching out  when media reaches out to us to say, Hey, we want to interview. Right. We want to interview you and Matt.  Okay, well, Matt needs an interpreter. He’s deaf. Oh, we don’t have a budget for that.  Like, right? Like, how are you gonna say you want to interview a deaf person? Do you sign?

I mean, like, even if you signed, you would still need an interpreter. And you have to explain that’s within a deaf person’s right to request. An interpreter, and under the Americans with Disabilities Act, one needs to be provided, if it’s  not, yeah, if it’s not, you, you could incur formal complaints, fines, and even lawsuits, I mean, but it’s like, who has time to be litigious for every single request that’s denied?

The deaf community. just gets tired of it. And then they’re like, okay, fine. I’m not going to go do that.  

And this was another point that I hit pause in the film. This is what, this was one of the things we talked about ADA. And so, and I’ll share that story. Now I was in Florida with a very good friend of mine.

He’s quadruple amputee. He’s in a wheelchair. I took him to a doctor’s appointment. We rolled up to the doctor’s appointment and two things happened for me. One, we pulled into a handicap parking spot, which was right next to another parking spot.  And then luckily, the parking spot right next to the handicapped parking spot was empty at the moment.

But here’s the thing. My friend has a van and that door opens and a ramp comes out  and there was not enough space. Should there have been a car in that spot, we couldn’t have got him out. I would have had to back up and this is just just one glimpse into his world. Right? Then we were, you know, we went up to the door,  there was no button,  there was no button.

And so luckily I was with him. I opened the door, but these were the things when you sit in the lens of someone who lives that life, it changes your perspective. And so to see your film, it changed my perspective. And I think that’s why I wanted to have you so badly on today. Was because we need to change our perspective and I’m not here to be political.

I’m not here to talk about laws, but that’s so powerful in your film is the fact that there, there is a law  that states. And so again, I paused and said, Hey, have,  what is it like? Who’s got to provide that?  Why if I’m on a rant, but if I’m hearing impaired, if I’m, I’m sorry, that’s if I’m deaf,  why should I have to go to a bunch of work to enjoy a concert?

Why can’t I just buy my ticket and enjoy the show?  And so one more thing, and I promise you, 

you mentioned comedy 

clubs, you mentioned We went to see, is it Nate Bargatze? How do you say his name?  

Loved it. 

Great show. Great show. But, there was a access at a special door.  We had an elevator to our seats.

And he had a special area to sit. My, my good friend.  To see Nate.  Would that same  thing have been available for someone that’s deaf? And that’s why that impacted me so hard is because yes, we’ve made a lot of progress. And so, as you said, I don’t want to put negativity in the world. What I want to do is create awareness, which is what your film has done so very well. 

Thank you. Yeah. I, Julie Rems Mario, this brilliant woman in the film, she talks about universal design, right? So curb cuts curb cuts were originally made for people in wheelchairs, right? But they also benefit so many other people who are not in wheelchairs, like parents with strollers who have to you  People walking on crutches, maybe elderly people, people like me with bad knees, you know, like can’t do a whole lot of stairs, you know, I mean, again, we just take that for grant those curb cuts.

We take for granted that they’re there. Right. And so it’s like, I think Jen Kirkman talks about it. Well, why isn’t there just an interpreter at the show? Why doesn’t the venue or the concert promoter build that into their budget from day one? Right. It’s not that great of an expense. It’s really not. And you can look at it like, yes, we should do this for like, because it’s the right thing to do.

Right. And oftentimes promoters. Don’t look at it that way. They’re looking at their bottom line. Well, how can I make a profit? Right? What’s the most I can make? And I understand that.  But if they could just look at it like, okay, you know what? Let’s spend.  Let’s just say 200 bucks, or even if we did a thousand dollars to have an interpreter for a concert, right?

Because if it’s an artist like Taylor Swift and it’s a long concert, you need a team of interpreters. Interpreting is It is very tiring work both mentally and physically. And so let’s say you spend a thousand dollars to provide a team of interpreters at your show. How many more people are going to buy concert tickets like, Oh, we’re welcomed here.

We’re included here. I don’t have to like struggle or fight to get access. Yes. I’m going to buy my ticket and go.  I think that, I think if that starts happening, it’s happening more with festivals. With like multiple artists. So I, I think that Live Nation is doing a great job with that. I think, and other concerts, other festivals as well.

But I think that it just has to be, it has to start somewhere. And I think that because the Deaf community has been denied for so long, that,  They’re not used to being included in those types of things.  And so I think it’s going to take a little bit of trust over time to go, Oh yeah, they really are including us.

Yes, we’ll go. Oh, they’re including us in that. Yes, we’ll go. Right. But I think it’s going to take some time to build trust that there will be interpreters there. I just don’t understand why people don’t do it. One, because it’s the right thing to do. And two, because you’re including so many more people.

Right. And it’s not just about ticket sales. Right. Once they get there, buy their ticket, then it’s like merch, then it’s like food and drink. And sure. Yeah, 

sure. Yeah. I mean, and I have to think the bottom line on that cost. So what are we talking about? And that’s, and now I get irritated, you know, when I, when I watched it, I found myself being emotional to the point of being irritated.

Like, wait a minute, what are we talking about here? And, and these artists. No disrespect. These artists are making a lot of money  and there’s artists in the film that talk about this. I think their eyes were open to the fact that there are people that are missing my show because I haven’t gained them access.

So please, please, please. And thank you for lighting the you just talked about it. How does it change? Well, it changes because of yeah. Things like your film and this thing that you’ve poured your heart and soul into creating.  It’s really important. And I want to praise you for that because it’s so important that people, and again, my wife works in this culture.

We have a deaf dog, like I said, it’s, it’s always been around our marriage because you know what, what she was passionate about, but at the end of the day, it, this applies to anyone. It applies to anyone. How can you not have a heart for someone who cannot hear? I don’t understand that or just anyone in general, but at the end of the day, this is the one that we don’t see, right?


I don’t 

know if someone can’t hear until they start signing.  

Do you know 

what I’m saying? Where if I see someone in a wheelchair, I know your struggle. I don’t know all the details of it, but I, I visually can see it. So that’s one. All right. So I have to move this and we have  so many questions for you and I know a little bit of time.

Okay. One of the things that you talked about  was the fact that let’s move to the actual interpreters.  What a job  and good and bad. Like I’m sure they love going to be in the front row at Taylor swift and be right there up against the stage. But one of the things, one of my favorite parts of the film was for the.

I don’t remember who it was and I don’t remember what they were talking about, but there are some artists who have some pretty raunchy language or, or, or you talked about them studying 

comedians and comedians, 

comedians. There’s some, some artists that,  Pretty raunchy. And maybe that doesn’t fit my, who I am, but this is the job I took, right?

That was incredible. So in, in a lighter moment, I guess, as we’re talking about this,  it’s gotta be crazy for the interpreters. To interpret a show that maybe they’re just not real comfortable with, but the lyrics, it’s important, right?  Yeah. Can you just talk about that?  

I, I mean, I am not an interpreter.


At all. I, you know, I know some sign language. I’m not fluent. But from, you know, I think it’s important that, And again, Amber Graves talks about this, that the interpreter matches the artists to some degree, culturally, a cultural thing. I can give an example of Matt, my executive producer. He’s a black deaf male in his thirties, and he and I went to go see the black, brown comedy get down.

So it’s like D. L. Hughley, George Lopez, Cedric the Entertainer, right? And we requested, Interpreters and not that these people didn’t do a fabulous job with what they could, but they were white women  interpreting for a black and brown  male comedians, right? And so.  I think they were really uncomfortable.

They didn’t, there were some signs that they did not sign because they were, the N word was used very freely by Cedric, by DL, right? And these white women did not feel comfortable saying that, like, of course, right? But sometimes that takes away from The experience of the deaf person who’s trying to enjoy and get access to everything that is being said.

So I think it’s important for venues when they get these requests that they reach out again in plenty of time to be able to request appropriate. A lot of, some are, I won’t say a lot, some artists like Waka Flocka has what’s called a designated interpreter in his rider. So if he, if at one of his shows an interpreter is requested in his rider, it says, we prefer to use.

Definitely the team at definitely dope. And so I know widespread, widespread panic. They also have a designated interpreter in their writer. Her name is Edie. I got to interview them. Unfortunately I could not fit everybody in the film and 55 hours of footage and had to whittle it down to. 78 minutes.

So yeah, I think, you know, making sure that the interpreter fits culturally, the, the artist and the event is really important.  Yeah. And they have so much to do to either, you know, they try to communicate with the deaf people ahead of time to see how do you want this interpreted? 


Cause sign language is not exact English.

It has its own grammar, its own syntax. Right. And so it’s like, do you want me to sign word for word in English? Do you want me to translate this into ASL? And so there’s a lot that goes into interpreting. It’s a, I,  yeah, I give all credit.  Interpreters and to deaf performers and deaf interpreters. It’s incredible what they do.

It really is. And you just mentioned a great point. So when I asked my wife to marry me because I knew she was in school for that, I went to the library and I bought a book or I, I, I bought a book. I got a book from the library and I looked up, I’ve waited my whole life to ask you this. Will you marry me?

And I wanted to sign that. And we had this huge crowd and there was all these people. This was the big moment. This was the huge moment. Well, she learned ASL.  So she couldn’t understand a word I 

was saying to 

your point. To your point,  I was signing. We figured it out. We’re married today still, but, but to your point, it is different.

So that is interesting too. There were so many levels. That’s why I, we can’t cover enough. I have so many more questions, but I know our time is limited. Gosh, it was, you have to see the film. So that’s the question I have for you. What’s the best way that people can learn. Obviously the film, Hey, go watch the film.

I I’ll say that for you. Go watch the film, download Tubi, watch the film. That’s.  Point one, but how else can, how else can we, what can we do better? How can we be better?  

I mean, it’s something as simple as learning the alphabet in sign language can help be more inclusive, right? You can take classes. The deaf community is very,  it’s, it’s varied.

I should say like V A R I E D. Right. And there. You know, to learn from a deaf person who has been immersed in that culture from day one, right, is, is often beneficial. There are, there’s a great series actually on YouTube.  It’s called Life Print and it’s with Dr. Bill Vickers. And he basically starts like lessons, ASL lessons, like from, Like,  like one to a hundred, right.

And he’s a teacher at a college in California. I think it’s in Sac, I think he’s in Sacramento. And he like has a great series on YouTube to learn.  Sign language. Mm-Hmm. So you can learn at your own pace. There are apps called, oh, what’s the some? I just downloaded. Well, I didn’t just download it. I’ve had it for a while.

Lingo, L-I-N-G-V-A-N-O. And it’s taught by all deaf people and it’s really cool. It’s kind of like, you know, you play a game, you’ve got your daily streak, you learn new words, you learn phrases. Love it. Yeah, just take some classes, be open to communicating, whether that’s if you know no sign language and you’re writing down on a piece of paper.

Or texting on your phone and showing, you know, just  stay open to communicating with people who are different than you, you can learn so much. You can learn so much from them.  

How can we support you?  

Just watch the film. And, I mean really, watch the film. You’re the perfect example. Like you’re the perf, like  as an edu, so I said, I’ve been a teacher for 24 years and I was, I was adjunct, which is just a fancy word for part timer.

Really that’s all it is, is just a fancy word for part timer. And I was underemployed during various points of my teaching career.  And I’ve thought of this film as just another opportunity to teach, right? But not necessarily in a classroom where I’m used to being, but just an opportunity to teach on a different platform to a bigger audience.

So when I hear you say things like, Oh, I learned this or I had to pause and ask this question, or I like wanted to like that to me, like, that’s a win. Like that’s the biggest compliment that I could ever get about this film is that someone learned from it. And that someone is taking steps to be more inclusive in their own life.

And whether that’s just being kind and respectful to someone and maybe understanding that their challenges are different than yours. Great. I think, you know, I’d love to start a campaign where each artist, you know, like reach out to your favorite artists. Hey, why don’t you include an interpreter in your, put it in your writer included.

You know, that just isn’t, it should be a no brainer, 

no brainer. 

It should be a no brainer. And I’m hoping that all of the artists that are in the film, once they kind of see it, right. Cause you know, we just had, sometimes I got to interview someone for Three minutes and sometimes, you know, it was asking like one question.

Sometimes it was a little bit of a longer conversation. Right. But I hope each, each artist watches the film and realizes, Oh, as a whole, this is what she was trying to do. And yes, let me take a step to be more inclusive. Let me, let me put that I have to have an interpreter in my writer at every concert. 

And we’re going to talk, we live in a crazy world and there’s a lot of crazy requests right now to be I’m not being political, but, but you know what I mean? As an educator, you’ve seen it in schools. There’s a lot of really insane things right now, but this is not, this is, this is truly not like if I was born and I can’t hear,  My gosh, what are we doing if we’re not providing just the essential tools for someone who was absolutely born with That is how God made them, is that he chose to not  give them hearing.

How can we not, and now I’m on a rant, but if, if an artist can have in their writer green M& Ms and a certain drink or a certain water, 


we pay for an interpreter for three hours that will do the, and, and if I’m the artist.  I want that interpreter to there’s one in the film that gets into she Oh, girl was dancing during it was so she was so good.

She was so good. And I’m like, I love that. If I’m the artist, I want her at every one of my shows because she represents me, too. The people that came, that did, that can’t hear like we can anyway, we could talk all day. There’s so many things, right? If you’re,  

oh my gosh, layers to what you just so 

many layers.

There are some artists that don’t want to share their spotlight and they feel that with an interpreter on the stage or near the stage that it will take away from  their, yes.  And also, you know, as hearing people, I have the same experience as you did when I first saw an interpreter. I was like, Oh my God, this is incredible.

But I have no idea what they were saying. I have no, no idea. Right. But it’s a beautiful visual language. Right. And so at some point, like as I’m focused on the interpreter going, Oh my God, this is incredible. But then I I’m here to enjoy the artists and I want to see, I want to watch the artists seeing, I want to hear them saying, I want to know, you know what they’re talking when they’re interacting.

Right. And so deaf people. It’s really important to have an interpreter close to the stage because if you think about it, if you’re looking at a stage and you can see the interpreter and the artist at the same time, that’s what, that’s the, they need to be in their sightline. A lot of artists will say, no, I want the interpreter over there.

And they put them on an ADA platform.  Is not in the line of sight. And it’s like, well, where do I look? Do I look at the interpreter and then I don’t see the artist at all. So it’s, so there’s so many things that,  that need to be changed. And again, I’m really hoping that changes are starting to happen in the industry.

I hope two, five, 10 years from now. My film would be obsolete that there’d be absolutely no reason for anyone to watch it other than like for a historical, like, Oh, this is where we were. Do 

you remember where we 

are now? Yeah. Like, yeah, I, five years, that would be the dream. Like no one would need to watch.

Sign the show.  

Well, I, I want everyone to watch Sign the Show. It’s very, very important. And I’ll tell you this too, like, as you were talking, so I’ve gone to basketball games now and they have the jumbo, the humongotron, I think they call it. I’m at a game and I’m sitting in my seat, but I’m watching this huge screen because it’s beautiful and it’s HD and everything else.

Yeah. Yeah. And then I’m like, I’m at the game. Like I should be watching the people on the court back to your point about an interpreter. But anyway, that’s completely random. Okay. So I do want to close with this. How can we best support you? Is the best way to support you to buy the film? And it’s probably a couple of bucks like on Apple or Google, like does that support you better?

Or does it matter? Is like, I know, so just 

honestly, I don’t think it matters. 


Like to be Apple TV, Google play or YouTube. I think it’s whatever platform you typically use, right? To be the only one that’s free and you watch with ads, all the other ones, it’s either a rental fee of like three 99 or four 99, or you can buy it for 9.

99. But I think.  To support me is just to watch the film on one of those platforms. It does not matter to me. And share, tell their friends to watch. Yes. Yeah. Share this 

episode, share the film. And, and to your point, honestly, the commercials in Tubi gave me a chance to look at my wife and say,  Hey, like I have so many questions, you know, and I got to ask her questions in between the segments.

So Tubi’s not, as long as you’re getting the right compensation,  download Tubi for free, search it, 

and please watch the film. Yeah, here’s something, my executive producer Matt and I, We’d love to go into businesses and organizations, screen the film and do a Q and a, and oftentimes we get like a stipend from somewhere to do that.

And we love to go out and do that together. I think it’s a great balance of, You know, a hearing perspective and a deaf perspective, his input and help with the film. I could not have done it without him. I could not have done it without a lot of people, but yeah, you know, if you want to book us and hire us to come and talk to your company or organization about diversity, equity, inclusion, and access, 


Access is huge. It’s huge. We’d love to 

do that. And Matt is, Matt is amazing. If you see him in the film, he’s got this energy that, that comes at you even on screen, but in person it’s just like a million times more like magnificent.  

Where can they, can they do that through the same website? 

If they go to signtheshow.

com there’s all of our contact information where they can find, Sign the show on all social media, Facebook, Instagram, or X, whatever it’s called now, Twitter. Yeah. And, and again, to be Apple TV, Google play and YouTube.  

Thank you so much. Aaron, 

thank you. No, I’m, 

I’m going to be a massive advocate for you and I don’t think you and I have had our last conversation.

I don’t, whether that’s another interview or everything you just talked about, you know, my I do believe that that God works in mysterious ways, and I do believe that that he  I saw that tweet for a reason in a random scroll. I watched that film with my wife. I gained a new perspective on what she does every day.

I’m so thankful for how hard that had to be for you to make this film, but how hard you worked and you did an amazing job, you really, really did. Again, I it’s on point for me to cry in an episode, but I’m trying not to, but I’m, I’m I’m proud of you. I know I don’t know you, but I’m so proud of you. It was,  


it’s incredible.

And how dare we,  how dare we how dare we not include someone. Who can’t have the access that we have. Thank you for your film. 

Thank you. Thank you.  Your, 


your viewers can’t see this. Wait, wait, there’s a new one. 

There was a new one. The, the, yes.  

That’s I really love. I 

really love you. Thank you. Yes.

I never knew that. So again thank you for your film. Thank you for your passion for this. And please, anyone listening to this, please, please, please,  download Tubi, watch the film. Be changed. And then let’s do something about it. Let’s not just watch a film and say, wow, that was really good. Like, let’s do something about it.

Push your favorite artists. If you know an artist, tell them to get someone that will take care of those people that just want to go to their show and to have access that we have. So  thank you, my friend. Thank you so much. 

Thank you.